the bunny drew a blade
instead, you know
the rest.

the bunny only had to stay
underground where bunnies stay
free to stay.

penance for needing without providing
protection.

innocence in the truest sense
and the weakest, ignorance.

peace in wartime.

peace on earth.

forgiveness for getting love.

it held on tight weaponry
honed steel in the name
cut drew blood:

forgiveness, penance. innocence, peace

the bunny wanted to sleep
underground where roots connect sprawling
dreamy trees to the sea
earth.

i think art that promotes or stands for or expresses values that make me uncomfortable is great.
but  games can go beyond promotion and expression, they can perform a more tangible act of coercion.
and this coercive act is what i regard as fundamentally part of 'gameplay'.
i guess i do have to define gameplay.

Quoteis your point today REALLY a very contrived variation of "art that isn't immediately obvious to understand is just trying to mislead people and real art is all about directly bluntly stating good clean values to people"??? I WONDER IF ANYONE'S EVER SAID THAT ONE BEFORE. kill abstract art btw

this one is a really really bad misunderstanding of how i feel, which isn't to say it's a misinterpretation of my words.
i don't think that art should be immediately obvious to understand, i rather think that it should be absolved entirely of such responsibility.
real art is about directly bluntly coming into being.
my issue with gameplay is that it, as i perceive (or i could say define) it, is too concerned with controlling how the work is perceived and experienced.

back to narfnra

QuoteYes, it is a provocative statement designed to make me reply to it online. Hence I am doing so now. I have nothing against people saying risky things. But in turn, I am allowed to say when I believe these statements are under-baked and lacking in meaning.

There are real points within this field of discussion. I truly do feel like the perspective is sincere. But sincerity on its own does not mean you can't be walking off into self-destructive and obsessively utilitarian angles that just come across as fash to me. Is that bad faith reading?

Perhaps! But just as the original statement can be provocative in turn, so too can I note when you're drawing suspiciously close to age-old brain traps. And I really think there is a higher standard when branding and sale gets involved. I don't like it.

branding and sale. yeah. i don't like it either.
"self-destructive and obsessively utilitarian angles that just come across as fash to me." i dont know anything about fash. maybe i should read up to figure out what it actually is so i can figure out... what it is? what is fascism, what has it lead to, how have its functional components lead to those consequences?
i think i assume that these thoughts are related:

- puritan hand-wringing
- preachy
- fash

Jake Eakle

Quotei know him personally (but we're not close, we just hung out at GDC once and then chatted a handful of times online) and frankly i share a lot of your concerns here and have tried to talk to him about it a bit... but i do also think there's real value in there, too. it's confusing and frustrating.

like.. he'll tell you over and over it doesn't really mean anything, it's just the phrase that has lodged in his brain to encapsulate an inexpressible cluster of feelings developed over a long career, and it's something that has demonstrably gotten him out of a creative rut and Making Stuff again.

but like.. yeah, it lands the wrong way for just about everyone? and i think i agree with you that there's some kind of responsibility that comes with a platform... but there's also good in pushing people to look more deeply at things, to interrogate their angry responses to abstract provocation.

I'm not willing to say "you should never say anything online that might hurt someone". that way lies silence. it's a nebulous, precarious balancing act and you can never know all of the relevant factors so deciding "correctly" is impossible but nevertheless i do think it's good to take risks.

and like. as much as i vehemently do not "agree" with "kill gameplay", it /has/ gotten me to think & talk to people about ideas in a way i like. and it has gotten me the droqevers, which are really great games (with great gameplay in them). haven't played teog yet but i prolly will soon...

but even given all of that i think you're absolutely right that it's kind of too much and there's sort of an abdication of specificity in some of his posts on the subject, so again.. frustrating and confusing!!

"it lands the wrong way for just about everyone" is interesting. im not sure i agree with that but maybe people just don't tell me! or, i mean, i guess that's not true. i hear a lot of people tell me... they dont get it or they dont like it. then i talk with them about it wayyy too much and then they are like, ok you're way too extreme but i kinda get it. so i  guess i DO agree that it lands the wrong way for just about everyone, lol.

i agree w everything that jake eakle is saying about it being a confusing and frustrating thing for me to be saying. like, i don't know! what am i supposed to do! i'm confused and frustrated and, perhaps, have a really bad habit of just saying shit online. so i say it! i mean, i said it in person too, i said it to my friends, i said it many times. i'm going nuts over here. and i agree with everything that jake eakle is saying about it being a weird fucking balancing act. i don't know!!! do i really have a platform??? i just say things and i know a bunch of people. some people have much larger platforms. i think everyone has a platform and is equally responsible for the things that they say, but i could be wrong. i'd love to absolve myself of responsibility and just do things.